tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4691609183217207055.post8318239385235754526..comments2024-03-27T22:20:55.710-04:00Comments on I Fly By Night - clash bowley's blog: System Structureclash bowleyhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/02867031157318138584noreply@blogger.comBlogger11125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4691609183217207055.post-31961051691858878002009-07-25T23:31:50.413-04:002009-07-25T23:31:50.413-04:00@ Rog
My preferences go all over the map. I have ...@ Rog<br /><br />My preferences go all over the map. I have seen all of these models work well in a game, and seen elements of all three in the same game, and it's all good.<br /><br />@ Levi<br /><br />Examples? Ok. I think the following are good examples: <br /><br />Accretive - AD&D <br /><br />Disappearing - BRP<br /><br />Thematic - Dogs In The Vineyard<br /><br />Framework - Coyote Trail<br /><br />-clashclash bowleyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02867031157318138584noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4691609183217207055.post-71409340741044872912009-07-25T17:23:03.095-04:002009-07-25T17:23:03.095-04:00Need 'zamples!Need 'zamples!Levihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04247835570586914825noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4691609183217207055.post-56073836329460327572009-07-25T12:37:12.449-04:002009-07-25T12:37:12.449-04:00Mostly I prefer a minimal system that after a few ...Mostly I prefer a minimal system that after a few runs becomes second nature to all using it but have enjoyed systems that are pure crunch, in the end its the gaming and not the game Im after.<br />As a long time Traveller gearhead I do love making ships etc that have very detailed and complex systems behind them but in the end when using them in the game that part just becomes fluff.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4691609183217207055.post-507800647441502082009-07-25T12:19:43.204-04:002009-07-25T12:19:43.204-04:00Thanks for dropping by Bill and Roger! :D
As you ...Thanks for dropping by Bill and Roger! :D<br /><br />As you implied in your comments, I'm not saying these three models are unitary - i.e. you can mix and match models within a game system. Each model has its own pluses and minuses, and by mixing models, you can alter the overall feel. What that mix is is entirely up to the designer. My Myers-Briggs profile pegs me as analytical and non-judgmental, so I do not think any one model is superior to any other. just different, and that means for a particular applications, one may be better than another. It's all to taste anyway. :D<br /><br />-clashclash bowleyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02867031157318138584noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4691609183217207055.post-68073133000482263672009-07-25T11:59:59.276-04:002009-07-25T11:59:59.276-04:00I agree with HinterWelt a system should be a part ...I agree with HinterWelt a system should be a part of the setting where ever possible and mold into its background.<br />A lot of this depends on the system being used I guess a simple Disappearing style of low mechainics will merge easier than one using a lot of intergrated options (Framework).<br />In its main d20 was a workable Disapperaing system but got lost in the hoard of splat that followed IMO D6 in its StarWars form was an invisible as Ive found since.<br /><br />Rog.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4691609183217207055.post-2919526066955395792009-07-25T11:41:13.125-04:002009-07-25T11:41:13.125-04:00Ah, Clash, as a "System does not matter at le...Ah, Clash, as a "System does not matter at least in that way" kind of guy you know my stance on the whole "System must model the setting". That said, i think I may have used all your models at one time or another although, I would probably say nowadays I am mostly a Framework with a dash of Disappearing and maybe just a bit of Accretion.<br /><br />As to system mattering, well, i think the elements of a system matter. They matter subjectively and to the user of the system, but there is no empiracal measure of how a system must model a setting. Support it, sure, but you and I both know that is not the same as modelling it. ;)<br /><br />I look forward to more entries oh wise master.HinterWelthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07442659544186176567noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4691609183217207055.post-55678963186059651712009-07-25T10:33:30.190-04:002009-07-25T10:33:30.190-04:00Hi Mike! Glad to have you dropping by! :D
-clashHi Mike! Glad to have you dropping by! :D<br /><br />-clashclash bowleyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02867031157318138584noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4691609183217207055.post-7902263570764042392009-07-25T09:08:31.907-04:002009-07-25T09:08:31.907-04:00Clash,
Good to see you're blog. I've ...Clash,<br /> Good to see you're blog. I've always enjoyed your perspective on forums and now look forward to hearing more here.<br /><br />MikeAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4691609183217207055.post-65726634091741707042009-07-24T18:10:47.480-04:002009-07-24T18:10:47.480-04:00Ah! I can post now! Marvelous! :D
You bring up an...Ah! I can post now! Marvelous! :D<br /><br />You bring up an excellent point, Rich - that in order to sell games, we small press publishers must market them to the only group of roleplayers who are actually listening. This is the web-aware group. <br /><br />When I started publishing, I looked around the web, having never looked here for roleplaying stuff, and was amazed at how much *stuff* there was here. This from a guy who had been on the web since the only browser was Mosaic - a unix guy. It just never occurred to look. <br /><br />This - I think - may be the situation with many roleplayers. They are used to getting their news from other sources - the FLGS and word of mouth from friends - and never think of looking on the web for roleplaying stuff. The web is for other things.<br /><br />Anyway, glad to see you here! ;d<br /><br />-clashclash bowleyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02867031157318138584noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4691609183217207055.post-39660265943748245842009-07-24T17:59:17.309-04:002009-07-24T17:59:17.309-04:00This comment has been removed by the author.clash bowleyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02867031157318138584noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4691609183217207055.post-43498893230503940172009-07-24T12:50:50.254-04:002009-07-24T12:50:50.254-04:00Congratulations on your first blog post. You chose...Congratulations on your first blog post. You chose a fitting topic, as the person who taught me that system matters. <br /><br />As a rule, I don't give much thought to the theory of game mechanics. I just create system tools, put them through their paces, and adjust them accordingly. I don't think there is a flawless set of system rules out there. Conversely, I think 80 per cent of the existing system rules are perfectly usable (despite their "flaws.) <br /><br />In the early days of gaming (for me, it was 1979/1980) we adapted and we overcame. I think that continues to day among mainstream gamers. While a lot of moaning and groaning occurs on internet fora, I don't think those doing the moaning and groaning are representative on the mainstream gamer. Quite the opposite. In many ways, I think the mainstream gamer has evolved far beyond the hardcore hobbyist that frequents internet fora. The mainstream gamer continues to adapt and overcome; the hardcore hobbyist has forgotten how to do so and would much rather complain instead. <br /><br />Still, as an independent game publisher it is the hardcore hobbyist that I have easist access to, and so it is the hardcore hobbyist that I have to satisfy. <br /><br />This brings me back to the fact that "system matters." It matters because I have to satisfy a group with very select tastes. It matters because this same group is my customer base. The same holds true for many small press publishers, I think. And, if there is innovation, it is coming from these same small press publishers. As a result, it is the "system matters" crowd that is calling the shots in terms of present-day game design. <br /><br />This presents a problem to me, because when I really decide that something is of utter umportance, I tend towards perfection. And, as I stated very early on in this preamble, every system has its flaws and therefore cannot be perfect. And so, I revisit the mechanic again and again while neglecting the thing that always attracted me to gaming in the first place, setting (which includes the application of the genre of the game). <br /><br />This necessary focus on system, has slowed my production rate to a crawl. Not that I mind. The game does get finished, just much more slowly.<br /><br />- RichAnonymousnoreply@blogger.com